RE: Did Linda Salas Lie to Boulder County?

["Liss, Josh" <jliss@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

oh brother.  Believe whatever you want, Joe.

I want to make it very clear that in this conversation I am disagreeing with you and your specific statements, not with the beliefs or statements of any other members of the CVV.  I am not casting any dispersions on the CVV as a whole, nor any of its members.

I am not in any way attempting to "usurp" the good will and credibility of the CVV.  The CVV, along with all other citizen-based interest groups play an important role in our society and in the formation of the policies of our government.  That is why I subscribe to the CVV email list.  I am interested in hearing the opinions of citizens who want to be involved in the elections process.  

What I grow increasingly tired of is the regular postings by you filled with speculation, innuendo, half-truths or misrepresentations with little or no factual basis constantly aimed at smearing the integrity of the dedicated men and women who work very hard to conduct the elections in this county.  These people work far too hard in ensuring the integrity of the elections process in this county and they do not deserve to be constantly attacked by you for doing their jobs.  I'm sure there are members of CVV who do not agree with every opinion you offer up as "fact".

The "complaint" you refer to is false.  The organization was not excluded.  The Evaluation Team was falsely accused of not containing representation from the CVV.  Documentation was provided which proved the accusation to be false.  If you choose to label these facts with some dark conspiracy theory, so be it.

Logic?

Just because you personally were not asked to be a member of the evaluation team, that does not mean that the CVV was not represented.  Are you the ONLY person who is allowed to speak as a member of CVV?  I heard this same kind of "logic" back in grade school.  Someone would say, "I wasn't invited to the party, so the people at the party must not be cool."

I respectfully disagree with your "logic", and I'm done with this conversation.

Have a nice weekend!



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Pezzillo [mailto:jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 1:09 PM
To: Liss, Josh
Cc: CVV Voting; Bailey, Shelley; Salas, Linda
Subject: Re: Did Linda Salas Lie to Boulder County?



"No formal written invitation was sent to any of the Evaluation Team  
members"

Then what did the ACLU decline?

CVV was not invited to participate, and you misleadingly added CVV to  
the roster and your statements only after a complaint was lodged that  
you had excluded the organization. Your attempt to usurp the good  
will and credibility of CVV is the grasping at straws.

I'm glad to know you can add small integers, next we'll work on the  
logic.

Joe



Joe Pezzillo
PO Box J
Boulder, CO 80306 USA
jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx
303-938-8850



On Apr 7, 2006, at 1:01 PM, Liss, Josh wrote:

> This is getting old, Joe, and I think you are grasping at straws here.
>
> Bo Shaffer is a member of CVV.
>
> Bo Shaffer was on the RFP Evaluation Team.
>
> A member of CVV was on the Evaluation Team.
>
> 1 + 1 = 2
>
> No formal written invitation was sent to any of the Evaluation Team  
> members.  No fancy invitations.  No formal RSVPs.  I called each of  
> the members personally and asked them to participate.  Bo Shaffer  
> (a member of CVV) was INVITED to participate.  He chose to do so  
> and we are glad that he did.  His contributions to the Evaluation  
> Team were invaluable and we appreciate his participation.
>
> It would be a misrepresentation for anyone to imply that CVV was  
> not represented when, in fact:
> 1. A member of CVV was on the Evaluation Team
> 2. There were five separate opportunities during the evaluation  
> process for any member of the public to offer testimony, including  
> members of CVV.  Whether they declared their membership or not,  
> members of CVV did testify (yourself included).
> 3. We received and reviewed several written submissions from  
> members of the public (including members of CVV) during the  
> drafting of the RFP.
> 4. We received and reviewed several written submissions from  
> members of the public (including members of CVV) during the  
> evaluation process.
> 5. Several members of CVV offered testimony during yesterday's  
> public hearing.
>
> If you disagree with Bo, that is between you and Bo.  But it is a  
> misrepresentation on your part to imply that CVV was not  
> represented when IT IS A FACT that a member of CVV was on the  
> Evaluation Team.
>
> If you are a member of a political party, but you do not agree with  
> every part of your party's platform, does that disqualify you as a  
> member of that party?  Of course not.  We all have the right to  
> agree to disagree.  That is one of the great things about this  
> country.  Are you trying to say that if a member of CVV disagrees  
> with another member of CVV, that person should not still be  
> considered a member?
>
> I think it is you who are making misrepresentations when you imply  
> that Linda Salas lied yesterday when you know she did not.
>
> I'm sure we could go back and forth about this for days/weeks/ 
> months, but I have other work that I need to do.  At this point I  
> doubt that any amount of factual information I give you will change  
> your mind or keep you from continuing to make misrepresentations or  
> false innuendo about the Evaluation Team or the Clerk's Office so I  
> think it would be wise for us both to agree to disagree.  After  
> all, that is our right.
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Josh Liss
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Pezzillo [mailto:jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 9:50 AM
> To: Liss, Josh; CVV Voting
> Cc: Bailey, Shelley; Salas, Linda
> Subject: Re: Did Linda Salas Lie to Boulder County?
>
>
>
> I'm not disputing that members gave testimony, or ultimately if Bo is
> or isn't a member of his own choosing at any given time (although he
> did "back off" from the group in 2004, you may have read).
>
> I'm disputing the representation that CVV was invited to participate.
> You may recall that it took Neal McBurnett speaking out of turn to
> force the Republican member to acknowledge the public, and I don't
> recall that anyone ever said "I'm here speaking on behalf of CVV".
> Your lawyer was there, she might recall that I complained that CVV
> was not represented (as well as three other citizen action groups),
> and that in fact sometime after that, you must have added the name
> CVV or Citizens for Verifiable Voting to your committee roster.
>
> Linda clearly represented that CVV was invited to participate on par
> with the other named members such as the League and the parties.
>
> Show us the invite you sent to CVV to participate, or is there one?
> Who signed the non-disclosure on behalf of CVV? Where is CVV's copy
> of the binder?
>
> I think you have misrepresented. You are the one who chose to include
> mention of CVV in your report, and Linda is the one who chose to
> attempt to agglomerate the good will of the CVV common law mark and
> confuse the "marketplace" by suggesting an association where none
> exists.
>
> For servants of the public trust, this type of intentionally
> deceptive behavior is unconscionable.
>
> I await the invitation to participate or a retraction, you can even
> send a bitmap PDF and I don't think anyone will complain about that
> this time.
>
> Joe
>
>
>
>
> Joe Pezzillo
> PO Box J
> Boulder, CO 80306 USA
> jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx
> 303-938-8850
>
>
>
> On Apr 7, 2006, at 8:45 AM, Liss, Josh wrote:
>
>> Original email failed to reach some of the intended recipients, so
>> I'll try this again.  Please see response below.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Liss, Josh
>> Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 8:39 AM
>> To: '=SMTP:jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx'; Salas, Linda;
>> '=SMTP:cvv-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx'
>> Cc: Bailey, Shelley; Reichert, Marianne; Bo Shaffer (E-mail)
>> Subject: RE: Did Linda Salas Lie to Boulder County?
>>
>>
>> Joe,
>>
>> I think you have misunderstood.  Linda said a member of Citizens
>> for Verifiable Voting was *ON* the Evaluation Team.  Bo Shaffer is
>> a member of CVV, is he not?  Hasn't he been a member of CVV for a
>> long time?  Has Bo been kicked out of CVV?
>>
>> Linda also said that testimony was heard from such groups as CVV,
>> the Paper Tigers, and the Center for People With Disabilities.  As
>> a member of CVV and the Paper Tigers, you did testify before the
>> RFP Evaluation Team, didn't you?
>>
>> The answer to your question is "NO".  Linda Salas did not lie to
>> Boulder County.
>>
>> I hope this clarification helps.
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Josh Liss
>> RFP Evaluation Team Chair
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Joe Pezzillo [mailto:jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx]
>> Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2006 3:54 PM
>> To: Salas, Linda; Liss, Josh; CVV Voting
>> Cc: Bailey, Shelley; Reichert, Marianne
>> Subject: Did Linda Salas Lie to Boulder County?
>>
>>
>>
>> 4/6/2006
>>
>> Boulder County Clerk Linda Salas:
>>
>> Today, in testimony before the Boulder County Commissioners, you
>> stated that Citizens for Verifiable Voting had been invited to
>> participate in your latest RFP evaluation committee.
>>
>> Please immediately produce the invitation you sent to CVV to
>> participate or publicly retract your statements.
>>
>> A Boulder County attorney and the Commissioners have been CC'd on
>> this e-mail.
>>
>> If you do not produce the invitation you claimed you extended to CVV
>> or retract your statements, the next step will be to present this
>> information to the press.
>>
>> You have made false statements before the Boulder County
>> Commissioners before (1/29/2004), I can compile a complete list if
>> necessary.
>>
>> You may make your written statement of retraction to the CVV mailing
>> list, a statement from your staff will not be sufficient.
>>
>> Joe Pezzillo
>> PO Box J
>> Boulder, CO 80306
>> 303-938-8850
>> jpezzillo@xxxxxxxxx
>>
>>
>>
>
>